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Comment by 36395

Premeditation + Cheap Shot with chance to add +1 combo point talent + Kidney Shot = At least 10 seconds worth of stun-lock. Chain it in with other class's stunning abilities and your group can easily dominate.

Comment by 102740

Stun lock FTW

Comment by 91451

/cast Premeditation
/cast Cheap Shot

That will get you 5 combo points in 1 hit if you have points in Initiative. Very useful for stun locking.

Comment by 122037

i have a 70 rogue with glad weapons, and if your looking for a reason to roll rogue...your looking at it lol, this move has helped me kill warriors that if i didnt have these 2 extra combo points would have killed me, i cast premed then Shadow step then i let my instinct to the rest if its anything but a warrior or a uber-geared person i use CS on everything but mage/war, then if that hits i use hemo depending on wether or not initiative procs, if it does i either A) KS or B) rupture, the rupture is good but my personal favorite for locks, druids, paladins, and preists is the KS route it stuns em and they look like tools gettting hit by 1000+ hemos and 1200 ghostly strikes, my crit is about 25% and AP is around 1800 wiht my dodge at 22 and parry at 12, altogether premed makes a subtle rogue much MUCH more of a pain in the ass then any other class esspecially healers, instead of ShS'ing CS (2/3) then 2 to 3 hemo's thats 35x2/3 energy thats alot to waste on burst dmg...its premed(2) CS(2/3) and depending on initative 1 hemo and an evis KS or Rupture, i personally again love rupture on anything that cant heal themselves i rarley use evis now only because its BASE dmg, i hit him with ruture and i have deadly poisons stacked on 5's with a garrote and i die, theres a more / better chance of him dieing after i die :D

Comment by 155527

I love to use premed>prep>premed>garrote>rupture

it works wonders against heavily armored foes

Comment by 112089

this is good for flag runners or just generally people running away from you when sprint is down.

Vanish>Premed>Deadly Throw.

Get close enough and shadowstep.

Comment by L33tsauce

Warning: Using this ability causes you to receive a longer jail sentence.

Comment by veno3

This ability is being buffed in WotLK, according to the Beta.

NEW - When used, adds 2 combo points to your target. You must add to or use those combo points within 20 sec or the combo points are lost.

OLD - When used, adds 2 combo points to your target. You must add to or use those combo points within 10 sec or the combo points are lost.

Comment by 1771

macro it up with ambush/garrote/CS and u can use it without problems, every stealth = +2 combo points. FTW

Comment by 300120

WIth Initiative and Hemorrhage I see no need to use Premeditation if all you plan to do is open with Cheap Shot and Hemorrhage twice to get 5cp.

Try this... Use Premeditation and then use those 2 combo points for Slice and Dice (it does not break stealth). Then open as you normally would except now you also attack 20/30% faster.

Comment by shadowstevens

This talent is incredible for solo levelling with Subtlety. Basically the key talents are Initiative, HAT, Improved Ambush, Puncturing Wounds, Vigor, Relentless Strikes.
Something like this:
https://www.wowhead.com/cata/talent#fhecoxZZebczIGzzAzVcot

Then you can do this:
Premed -> Ambush -> 5-point KS -> BS X 3 -> 5-point Evis.
With only a 20 sec cooldown, you can do this on each kill.

Comment by Jrubzjeknf

This spell is not on global cooldown.

A simple macro adds this spell to your usual openers, increasing effectiveness without increasing buttonpresses.

#showtooltip Ambush
/cast Premeditation
/cast Ambush

#showtooltip Cheap Shot
/cast Premeditation
/cast Cheap Shot

Comment by 562685

Incredibly potent for a levelling rogue. With the premed-ambush macro you'll have a 5 cp eviscerate immediately, Not only do you kill mobs faster than any other class can manage, but you have the most ridiculous burst potential in pvp. Imagine Ambush -> Eviscerate -> Vanish -> Ambush -> Eviscerate!

Comment by parazyte

While it may work on the target dummy and on bosses engaged with a tank... You try that in PVP and let me know what you think. Prepare to get raped :-)

Plate wont notice you.
Healers will outheal you.
The rest will root you or disengage from you, and break your cycle.

Comment by Attis

If you'll use Redirect within 20 sec 2CP won't fade.

Comment by 904976

At low level you can use Premeditation 2 combo + Ambush 3 combo = 5 combo + eviscrate and you have a good chance to kill your enemy. you can also add a shadowstep before eviscrate for more damage with ambush

Comment by usescharcoal

a good way how to use this in pvp is if your dying vanish or stealth premeditate on someone and recuperate amd it should give you a decent amount of health. try this method!

Comment by Thottbot

It seems the expiration time is not working. It never happened to me.

Comment by Thottbot

is this a cast that takes 1 second but you can move (like bartols rod of transformation) or are you stuck in place for 1 second?

i will not blame anyone if they say this is a dumb question

just wondering

Vwooshman lvl 33 human rogue on the Uldum realm

Comment by Thottbot

Do you remain in stealth after you hit them? If so, you could do this, then Cheap Shot.. and SS until you complete combo points.. Then if you also have Cold blood you could have a nice opening damage! :)

Comment by Thottbot

is this any good?

Comment by Thottbot

doesn't break stealth and yes it pwns

Comment by Thottbot

You can�t have this and CB because you don�t have enough talent points

Comment by Thottbot

hehe it's true there is missing only 1 talent point to have both cold blood and premeditation too bad isnt it?:)

Comment by Thottbot

yes I understand this talent + CS is great
don't get it though, cold blood is hella better
anyways, ppl often overlook preparation, failing to realize that cold blood + preparation = own

Comment by Thottbot

when you use this with cheap shot then Hemorrhage it works great. From there you have the choice of droping their AC, stunning them, DOT them, or use Eviscerate to nuke them, this works when soloing and in groups. casters i use the stuns attacks, with tanks i use either dots or AC debuff.

Comment by Thottbot

can it be done not in stealth?

Comment by Thottbot

works really well with cheap shot and the talent with +75% chance to add a 3rd combo point to cheap shot!

cant use with CB
can use in and outa stealth and doesn't brake stealth

Comment by Thottbot

guys! for a start u use this... wait 4 energy to recover (only 10 energy so its easy!) then useing energy watch (and use talent to make 75% chance to add +1 combo with CS and amb) eather CS and attack or amb hopefuly get 2 combo points then gouge making 5 combo's)! would b great to have CB here but no luck so KS, BS or vanish and amb depends wat u've imp'ed! and ur off again!
how is this not better than CB! its a lvl 31 talent CB is lvl 21 so get lost CB premed here i come!
+ only 2 min CD not 3 like CB! and u still get preperation! and imp backstab bla bla bla

Comment by Thottbot

I'll have to try this!
Premeditation, preparation, premeditation, ambush and eviscrate!
Sounds nice :)
Will try it then post more :)

Comment by Thottbot

2 min cooldown and gotta use combos with 10 sec's

wat a noob

in other words... 1's per fight unless prep vanish....

Comment by Thottbot

unless i am totally misunderstanding what that guy is trying to acomplish, he is stating a legitimate idea. if you were to premed, then prep, then premed again, it theoretically could add 4 combo points. the "1's a fight" does not hold since prep whipes rogue abilities clean. i dont know if blizzard prevents this from stacking like that, but if you were quick enough, and engaged in combat fast enough, you could do this and open very strong. unless you guys have tried this and know for a fact that it does not work, dont call someone a noob just cause they thought of something you didnt.

Comment by Thottbot

Iam a 54 rogue on Moonrunner I truly look forward to getting this move only 3 lvls away now The Sub tree is awsome and Premed will really complelment my improved ambus although i figure I will probably use CS more often with premed (muwhaahahah 5cp one hit is gonna be real nice) my only disappointment is that I had to give up Relentless strikes so i could get this and keep riposte)all my only question now what to do with my 3 talent points that remain after I get Premed I have 6/11/28 any tips

Comment by Thottbot

So yeah, respecced and tried it out. You can infact do premed, prep, premed and get 4 cps on the target before the fight starts. I'd call it a waste of Prep but you can do it.

Also, you need to be within 15 yards, stealthed, and standing still for one second to cast it. No moving. No using it in combat. No using it unstealthed. At 15 yards you're in easy detection range of anyone facing you.

So since this seems to work best on stationary targets that are back on to you, this would seem to be focused more towards PVE than PVP.

Also, yes you can vanish out of the fight, prep and hit the premed again.

Comment by Thottbot

why have coldblood instead of This? u almost always crit with ambush if u are subtlety spec anyway

Comment by Thottbot

To make sure you are not detected while using this, just use imp. sap first. If if fails you can just restealth again if its in PvP.

Comment by Thottbot

maybe im wrong but, isnt this useless? because u have cheap shot which is the same but also stuns. u would rather use that wouldnt u?

Comment by Thottbot

My rogue is far from being my main. I just play on her occasionaly and am at level 41 now.

If you used premedatation, prep, premedatation again. You'd have 4 points.

Then ambush for a lot of damage and bringing your points to 5, which you can evicerate almost imediately.

That's gotta be one of the highest bursts any class can do? Even if its not that practical in reality.

Maybe get two rogues doing it at once to the enemy healer in an arena?

Comment by Thottbot

Improved sap (using this to wait for them to blow CD on their trinket to remove stun... just in case they have it), Cheapshot, premeditation, sinister strike, kidney shot, sinister strike spam, gouge, vanish, preparation, cheapshot, premeditation, gouge, wait for energy then eviscerate. If theyre not dead by this, please get better gear then try it =) ALSO get the slowest 1h weapon you can find for this. You probably wouldnt even need an offhand :P and you can put the damage poisons on both weapons, so you want fast offhand... with that being said, time to go make my rogue =)

Comment by Thottbot

Best Macro ever.

/cast Prem
/cast Cold Blood
/cast cheapshot
/use (any dmg increasing trinket)
/Cast Evis.

u can either do that macro in 2 clicks or make it two different ones if u want it on ur main action bar ( changes for stealth)

that macro gives u a 5 combo point 100% crit increase dmg evis on any class that is stuned. also taking more dmg if u have talents increase dmg 6sec after stealth.

i use this and get like 3000 crit then hemo + kindey shot (thats 3 combo point if hemo crits = 4secs) and then get like 2 hemos in and target should die by then. most ppl withaverage 70 gear have 6000 health (not warriors or warlocks) and that drops them in the 8 secs they are stuned. aka owned

Comment by Thottbot

I just wanted to add that without this talent it is possible to double BS a mob out of a CS, just barely though, but im unsure if it would also work on a player.

Also, I dont see how this talent would allow you to double BS a player out of CS if otherwise impossible, seeing as how it adds only 10 energy, and that still leaves you with only 50 at the important moment, not enough to BS.

P.S. i have never used vigor before, so my comment is entirely theoretical, other than the fact that a mob can be double BS, that is confirmed.

Comment by Thottbot

i want to follow this idea of lesmordius... 30/0/31

with this spec you could fight just like that:

premeditation ( 2 cp )
ambush ( 1cp + 75% chance for additonal 1cp + ( 45%+5%+25%
astimated critchance from equipment ))

just with opening with ambush, you have a high chance of having 5 cp right at the beginning of the fight.

coldblood
eviscerate

what do you think about that? note that you get 10% xtra dmg for both attacks from master of sublety, another 20% to ambush from oppotunity, the armore-penetration from serrated blades 15% xtra dmg to eviscerate through improved eviscerate and last but not least 4% attackpower bonus from deadlyness

if your enemy has to much health to finish him with this two blows, the skill opportunity works for backstab to, as well as improved beackstab for 30% xtra crit and 30% xtra crit damage from lethality :)so a die-hard would recive ambush, backstab, eviscerate => the end ^^ in hard fights just use vanish, preparation and repeat ^^ you could even start again, with your second vanish, you wouldnt have premeditation anymore though :)

Comment by Thottbot

Best way to use this abil is with a full sublety spec... with at least shadowstep unlocked. Pop premed then shadowstep ambush (should crit :p) and instantly use a 4 point (75% to get another CP off special moves is a sublety talent) eviscerate to make things really hurt. I prefer this to ambush backstab as sometimes it can take awhile for the 20 energy to tick and say a mage can blink away before the backstab... while eviscerate costs 25 less energy and does a backstabs crit damage non crit. You also have enough energy to do it instantly after the ambush so hopefully the hideous amount of dam you do in a few seconds will tilt things in your favour.

Comment by Thottbot

I'm the guy who posted above. I have thought on an ultimate one on one duel pawnage system and am proud to unveil my hardhitting strategy with yous guys. Premeditation Shadowstep Ambush Eviscerate (should have 4 CB's on the target) Blind Vanish Preperation Premeditation Ambush (up to you if you want to wait to use Shadowstep again tho I wouldn't bother) Eviscerate then finish off whats left :p I imagine this tactic owning most tho be fast to ensure you don't get dotted up.

Comment by Allakhazam

man i love this ability but adrenilane rush seems it would be far mor beneficial, any thoughts?

Comment by Allakhazam

2 Minutes ;]

Comment by Allakhazam

I would prefer Adrenalin Rush. Adrenalin Rush + Slice & Dice (with insatnt posion) does big dmg. And if you have Blade Flurry you can do most things easy.

Comment by Allakhazam

Anyone know the cooldown time on this ability?

Links

Premeditation

Premeditation

Talent

30 yd range

Instant	20 sec cooldown

When used, adds 2 combo points to your target. You must add to or use those combo points within 20 sec or the combo points are lost.

Spell Details

Duration

20 seconds

School

Physical

Mechanic

n/a

Dispel type

n/a

GCD category

n/a

Cost

None

Range

30 yards (Medium)

Cast time

Instant

Cooldown

20 seconds

GCD

0 seconds

Forms

Stealth

Effect #1

(Unknown Effect #328)
Value: 3
PVP Multiplier: 1

Effect #2

Apply Aura: ?? (Aura #560)
Value: 3
PVP Multiplier: 1

Flags

Is Ability
Cannot be used while shapeshifted
Do Not Sheath
Does not break stealth
Generates no threat
No AutoCast (AI)
No Aura Icon
Suppress Caster Procs
Does not engage target
Not an Attack
Not In Spellbook Until Learned

Premeditation

Buff

Spell Details

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